Thousands of youngsters have joined the army since October 7 — and it is illegal to refuse. Sofia Orr is likely to become the first woman since then to be jailed for refusing military service, but believes it is ‘wrong to take children and make them into soldiers’
  • unreasonabro@lemmy.world
    388·
    9 months ago

    I mean there are good arguments both for and against compulsory military service, but only in countries that aren’t prosecuting a war of genocide. Israel can go get fucked and so can America for propping it up. In fact it’s more proper to lay the blame at America’s feet than even Israels, since they’ve been “the adult in the room” (the one with the guns) who has been enabling it.

    • octopus_ink@lemmy.mlEnglish
      172·
      9 months ago

      I mean there are good arguments both for and against compulsory military service

      Are there good arguments for it? If it’s compulsory, maybe you need to run your country differently so people feel its worth voluntarily defending. And/Or you can recruit heavily in areas where folks are disadvantaged and have few options, dangling education in front of them in exchange for being willing to kill or die for you.

      The funny thing about knowing 18 year olds at 50+ vs being 18 years old is you can see the children these kids still are. Allowing them to join? OK. Forcing them to murder for you? As a veteran who joined at 19, no.

      https://youtu.be/UQH3ZYTtY68

      • Jordan_U@lemmy.ml
        4·
        9 months ago

        Or you can recruit heavily in areas where folks are disadvantaged and have few options, dangling education in front of them in exchange for being willing to kill or die for you.

        This is absolutely what we do in the U.S. and it’s abhorrent.

        I guess what I want is for nobody to be so desperate for their basic needs that they feel compelled to kill and die in war.

        And if we had a country that cared for all of its citizens and didn’t start wars of aggression, maybe more people would want to enlist as they have real values to protect and have a reasonable expectation that they won’t be committing atrocities?

        Honestly not a criticism of you or your comment. Lot’s of people are advocating for the same thing; You just said it plainly.

        …Anyway, this is all terrible and we absolutely can do better, starting with building community locally, mutual aid, protesting, and listening to marginalized and oppressed people’s.

        • octopus_ink@lemmy.mlEnglish
          4·
          9 months ago

          This is absolutely what we do in the U.S. and it’s abhorrent.

          I’m definitely aware and agree with all your points.

          Honestly not a criticism of you or your comment. Lot’s of people are advocating for the same thing; You just said it plainly.

          No worries, I did it somewhat sardonically. I don’t like that arrangement much more than compulsion. These are people we don’t trust to drink responsibly for three more years, but we tell ourselves it’s fair to expect them to make a mature, rational decision to sign their lives away for a period of time (or forever) with no life experience whatsoever.

        • octopus_ink@lemmy.mlEnglish
          4·
          9 months ago

          Ok, but barring corner cases…

          Edit - and arguably it’s still not a “good” idea - that’s something you do because you feel there’s no other choice at that point. It solves the short term problem, doesn’t strike me as healthy for the populace in a long term way.

          • OurToothbrush@lemmy.mlM
            2·
            9 months ago

            It is healthy for the populace in the sense that only 26 million people die instead of the vast majority of a population of 150 million, which would have happened without conscription.

            It is justified when the war is an existential threat to the people of an area, not of the state ruling the area.

            • octopus_ink@lemmy.mlEnglish
              2·
              9 months ago

              I don’t disagree at all, just saying it’s not a way to keep your standing army populated that I can agree with. I don’t think this is at odds with your clarification, but if I’m missing your point please don’t hesitate to reel me in.