I think this decentralization and federation is what web3 is all about, without all the corporations calling everything to do with monkey pixel art that costs a million dollars “web3”

  • Sun-Spider@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    Hey! This post is not specifically related to the lemmy.world instance. From now on, posts such as these will be removed, in order for the community to stay on topic. However, as this is a highly upvoted post, I’ll just lock it for now.

  • TheRealLinga@sh.itjust.works
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    1 year ago

    Honestly I’m not even sure what the term web3 means but Lemmy does feel… less commercial, which is really refreshing! And I’m noticing alot less criticizism which is excellent. I’m certainly going to be staying here and trying to help it grow in a positive and mindful way.

    I get what others are saying about it feeling like how the internet used to be… I’m really excited to see where Lemmy goes. Hopefully it doesn’t just end up the way its predecessors have gone! Feels like I’m part of a movement to fight the oppression!! Power to the people woo!

    • Astrovenator@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      That’s what I’m enjoying about it so far too. Content is sparse but that’s okay. I’m so tired of being marketed to, of being a product. These open source federated apps are janky and quieter, but they feel more real. These aren’t algorithms pushing engagement and outrage or ads every 10 seconds.

      • ThoreauIsCool@sh.itjust.works
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        1 year ago

        Right? It’s way calmer here. I felt hesitant about that at first, but it’s only because we’ve gotten so used to an endless stream of (often inconsequential and low-effort) content. More isn’t always necessary or better.

        Kid-me used to have days off and he’d hop onto Warcraft 3 or various message boards only to realize no one was online because everyone had jobs or was at school. It had a rhythm to it which was really cool. It wouldn’t surprise me if the “always-on” content spam of the modern internet has given people unhealthy ideas about what life is supposed to feel like.

        • taladar@sh.itjust.works
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          1 year ago

          I don’t mind the lack of an endless stream of content so much, however it would be nice if it was easier to not see the same content again and again after already reading it. Maybe some sort of read flag would be good for posts, possibly with a configurable number of new comments after which it is shown again.

      • Chef Rat@sh.itjust.works
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        1 year ago

        Plus on Reddit, corporation makes money from content users create while here everything is open, free and fun.

      • Edgerunner Alexis@dataterm.digital
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        1 year ago

        I agree wholeheartedly. I think what all of us who care about these alternative underground social networks need to do is try to provide the best content we can, because that will attract other people here, which will benefit us in turn through the content they make!

      • Faceman🇦🇺@discuss.tchncs.de
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        1 year ago

        There might be a case for a more sparse content feed. Sure you can subscribe to hundreds of communities across a hundred different servers but you are more in control of the feed. every post is going to be more relevant and you will have more incentive to take part in conversations instead of just refreshing and having a whole new page of crap.

        There are some ease of use improvements to be made of course, this is the most users and fastest growth lemmy has ever seen, so there is some learning to be done as it scales.

    • mcpheeandme@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      You nailed it: It feels like a movement. And movements, especially nascent ones, require buy-in and work from their members. I guess that explains why I feel obligated to participate more than I did at Reddit.

      I’ve only been on Lemmy for a day, but it’s already clear no one is gonna build this out for us.

        • TheRealLinga@sh.itjust.works
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          1 year ago

          Right? I’m thinking about trying to start my beginner guitar sub (do I still call it sub?). I tried on reddit, posted a few times and it fizzled out. Maybe it would be more successful here. Just a sub dedicated to helping people begin their guitar playing journey. Playing guitar has made such a positive impact on my life, I’d like to share that with others you know?

    • slashzero@hakbox.social
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      1 year ago

      What is sort of bothering me is how as it becomes more popular, I’ve already seen a few people asking about adding advertising to lemmy instances. I hope advertisers are not looking at diminished revenue with the reddit blackouts and trying to move to Lemmy already. I just can’t stand ads, and hope to never see ads interwoven with posts and comments.

      • doylio@sh.itjust.works
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        1 year ago

        I think it might be ok if some instances decide to run ads. Someone has to pay for the server costs, and ads are an option.

        The great thing about the Fediverse is you can move to a different instance if you don’t like it :)

        • Faceman🇦🇺@discuss.tchncs.de
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          1 year ago

          As far as I know, while account migration is technically possible it isnt implemented yet, so if a server decicdes to shut up shop due to lack of funds your account there is lost and only federated content on other instances will be saved.

          So once migration of user accounts and communities is implemented we should be able to easily survive waves of server closures.

          I do worry that it will eventually coalesce into a couple of ultra-large servers and lose a lot of it’s decentralisation though. gotta spread out!

          • omni_memer@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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            1 year ago

            I mean, I suppose creating alts on multiple instances might work as an alternative in the meantime. I don’t know if that’s frowned upon though.

            Completely agree on the last point, though. It is crucial that we spread out!

            • darkstar@sh.itjust.works
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              1 year ago

              I’ve made about 10 alts so far, just making sure to secure my username in case I do need to migrate somewhere

        • slashzero@hakbox.social
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          1 year ago

          True enough. And I know I’m just a drop in the bucket, but I will do exactly that if it ever happens.

      • CarbonIceDragon@pawb.social
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        1 year ago

        Technically it should already be possible for a company to advertise here, no? Not in the “there are little video boxes you can’t get rid of (barring adblocker extensions)” but in the sense that one could have their employees create accounts and make comments and posts to promote their products. They’d probably have to do it subtly and sneakily, because they’d likely get banned or if they had their own instance, defederated, but they could. Wouldn’t even need to pay anything beyond employee salaries to make it.

        I feel like “proper” ads would be more difficult to implement, because even if the software were updated to include the ability to add them, people could and likely would make forks of it that just didn’t display those from federated servers, or clients that don’t on any server, and because the software is open source there would be no stopping it. An instance could defederate instances using such an ad-blocking fork, but that would risk ending up themselves isolated and therefore lose much of their traffic and viability as a platform.

    • CoolioDood@sh.itjust.works
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      1 year ago

      Web3 became a marketing term, doesn’t even really have a clear meaning, but it’s used as a catch-all word for blockchain-related things like NFTs, cryptocurrency projects, etc. But most of those are not truly decentralized, whereas Lemmy and other fediverse projects are.

      • manitcor@lemmy.intai.tech
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        1 year ago

        I kind of like the idea of rebranding it around a more honest and inclusive definition of decentralization. Though getting past bad marketing is so hard it might not be worth it.

  • coltzero@feddit.de
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    1 year ago

    Yes, I would call it web1. Decentralization are basic concepts of the internet and it was more decentralized in the 90s. Getting back to the roots.

    • lyam23@beehaw.org
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      1 year ago

      Great point. Lemmy and Mastadon look more like an effort to claw back the web of open access and decentralization from VCs, grifters, and the like.

  • IninewCrow@lemmy.ca
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    1 year ago

    This is what reddit felt like ten years ago … now it’s just a matter of growing the community and making it bigger and better.

    I felt bad leaving my old communities at reddit … but in a funny way, I feel like I’ve stepped into a time warp and jumped back ten years … now I’m looking forward to the next ten on Lemmy and Mastadon

    • MaryAnna@lemmy.ml
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      1 year ago

      What about my funny ape pictures? Won’t someone think of my funny pictures that costs a cities worth of energy???

  • HakFoo@lemmy.sdf.org
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    1 year ago

    The web3 that can be named is not the true web3, or something like that.

    The “branded” Web3 was about “how do we create the third Web BUBBLE” more than “how do we create the third Web experience.” The people who missed buying AOL shares in 1996 or Amazon in 2002 wanted their chance to get in on speculation, except without the utility of an actual service or product underneath the hype.

  • Edgerunner Alexis@dataterm.digital
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    1 year ago

    I’m honestly very excited about Lemmy and Mastodon.

    With federated and decentralized technology, I think there’s a real hope of taking the internet back from the tiny selection of corporatized, monetized, sterile silos we have now, where everyone is forced to abide by the same compromise rules and everything can be co-opted or changed at a moment’s notice without the userbase’s consent, and giving it to smaller, more fun, radical, unique, and interesting internet communities, run by volunteers who really care, for like minded people.

    I think it will lead to a much more diverse and richly textured internet, maybe even a more human internet, since each place you go will be a smaller, more intentional community which policies itself and can develop its own interesting culture and set of norms, while still being connected to everything else so the rot of pure isolation doesn’t set in.

    Technology — especially how it is structured — is never neutral, and I think for the first time in a long while, we’ve stumbled on technologies in federation and decentralization that actually tend towards good things. The inherent benefits of federation and decentralization to autonomy and resilience and diversity and resistance tocorporatizationn are stunning, and as long as we don’t fuck that up by assuming that those benefits are sufficient, don’t rest on our laurels thinking we don’t need to maintain a culture that is consciously and intentionally oriented around preserving the things we want to see, I think we’ll be okay!

  • nattekrant@feddit.nl
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    1 year ago

    Web 1.0, users form communities on bulletin boards, internet forums and newsgroups. It’s the birth of Web 2.0, investors and advertisers see potential in large user bases. This leads to social media and mobile apps as fronts for tracking users and big data collection. Smart home and wearables become a plot to bring tracking hardware into your life even when you aren’t actively engaging on the internet. The tech billionaire is born at the cost of the privacy and wallet of the user. Web 3.0, a federated Web 1.0 where users take back control of the internet. Tech billionaires live in homeless shelters and eat ramen noodles.

  • Barbarian@sh.itjust.works
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    1 year ago

    It’s pretty dope. Been following the fediverse for a while, but I’ve never used twitter so mastodon felt kinda useless to me. I’ve never used facebook, so friendica felt kinda useless to me.

    Anonymous strangers posting links and having discussions? Now that’s more my jam.

    • slaacaa@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Same here, neither of those are my thing, but lemmy scratches my needs. Of course without reddit fucking up, I would never have checked it out, but now I’m really hoping this gets big, without losing it’s core

  • BadgerBadgerBadger@lemmy.ca
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    1 year ago

    It’s starting to feel like the 90’s again, but without frames ;-) I haven’t felt this engaged with the internet in years

  • Faceman🇦🇺@discuss.tchncs.de
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    1 year ago

    feels like a modern take on usenet/newsgroups/bbs.

    You pick your local server and your chosen feeds and enjoy.

    I hope as more small servers start up and die that we don’t just end up with a small number of mega size servers though, that goes against the point.

    • Mogofwin@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      I think one thing that may help with this is letting users stay on their instance when browsing others. Right now, if I want to hop over to another instance, I can definitely link there or comment if using the appropriate channel, but actually going there makes it seem like I am signed out. Implementing features like this https://github.com/LemmyNet/lemmy-ui/issues/1048 would help make the experience feel more cohesive, and encourage exploration of other instances without confusing users and accidentally encouraging sticking to one’s own instance.

      • Faceman🇦🇺@discuss.tchncs.de
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        1 year ago

        Yes, if a new user weren’t paying attention they would be caught up by that a lot.

        formatting links with /c/community@instance rather than full URLS works on some platforms, but only if the content linked has been federated, otherwise it is out of sync. You then have to know the link was good, the community exists, then do the copy paste into your search to force it to sync, then the link will work for you…

        That could be smoothed out with better fed request optimisation. it’s particularly poor on smaller instances that haven’t federated with much more than the few big servers, or self hosted instances that have to built that from scratch.

  • Lucien@beehaw.org
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    1 year ago

    Hah, web 2.0 was all about the explosion of user-generated content. Corps and cryptonerds wanted to make web 3.0 about making money, but the web has always been about the content, not its monetization. In trying to monetize the content, they’re alienating people and forcing them off the platforms they defaulted to.

    Humans like to create and share content, no matter how easy or difficult it is to monetize. If the people who want to monetize humanity’s collective output make it harder to create, then hopefully the result is that people move off the ad-supported platforms and replace them with something that doesn’t rely on centralization with lots of capital to stay afloat.

    If nothing else, the way that youtube has made it impossible for segments of the creative community to monetize their content and forced them rely on platforms such as patreon has made it more and more clear that ad-generated revenue is a dead end. You can’t force people to view advertising unless you hold their content hostage, and for the first time in history, they can’t buy out the means of production.

    • BobKillsNinjas@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      I was resistant to the federverses, but these corpos just think they can get away with anything…

      Fuck them I won’t do what they tell me!

      It will be fun to watch this place grow, it feels like the start of a new story!

    • ultimate_question@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      replace them with something that doesn’t rely on centralization with lots of capital to stay afloat

      There’s no conceivable reason that reddit shouldn’t be profitable right now with the market saturation they have unless the majority of people who’ve been making money off of the site up until now have been minimal effort contributors trying to get their piece of the money pie. 99% of the work is done by “unpaid” (by reddit) mods yet somehow they still have 2k people on the payroll and still need to centralize more and more capital to cover the overhead, it’s easy to imagine most of their current expenses are going to dumb corporate tech money sinks that are going out of style fast and have little to show for the last decade of spending lol

      • berkeleyblue@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        I mean that’s maybe the only good thing: If they are a public traded company, they have to file public revenue reports. Would love to see where those morons burn their money…

      • Lucien@beehaw.org
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        1 year ago

        2k people in expensive San Francisco office space. Willing to bet that the % of them dedicated to improving user experience was quite low in comparison to those trying to figure out how to squeeze money out of it.

    • bandario@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Every single platform that has claimed “Web 3.0” has been revealed to be a crypto scam, and generally not even a sneaky one. Pop over to minds.com if you’d like a free taste of exactly what that ends up looking like. It’s disgusting.

  • gawdahm@sh.itjust.works
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    1 year ago

    I don’t know, it just feels like a fancier web 1.0 where things were less centralised (personal websites, forums etc).

    • a1studmuffin@aussie.zone
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      1 year ago

      I gotta admit though, this has to be one of the first reasonable use cases for blockchain technology that I can think of - a P2P database for social forums… decentralised, but a single “instance” no matter how you access it. I imagine the blockchain sizes would get ridiculously large though, and all sorts of moderation issues. Probably not feasible, though I’m sure there’s a project on GitHub I’m not aware of…

      • cryball@sopuli.xyz
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        1 year ago

        If you were to host the entire forum on a blockchain, every node would have to hold the blockchain. So not scaling horizontally, but instead copying the “database” a bunch of times. Think of hosting all of the data in reddit on a thousand nodes. Sure you could access it from any node, but the database would be just as big as before, just copied around a bunch of times.

        In a way this thing is already much more decentralized than a blockchain could ever be, in that every server doesn’t hold all of the data at once. Much better use of resources IMO.

        • veaviticus@lemmy.one
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          1 year ago

          A much better use of resources, but you shard the data amongst potentially untrusted hosts (ie, anybody can stand up a lemmy instance and start hosting posts/comments, and then get sick of hosting it and delete their instance and all the uploaded data).

          Federation only allows access to the network of servers, it doesn’t protect the data at all, which means at any moment an entire community of useful historical information could just be wiped away (especially since there’s currently no monetary incentive to continue hosting, its only being done out of desire to be part of the network).

          I guess I’d rather see the blockchain (or simpler caching/mirroring) approach, something like the torrent network, so that no single person has access to delete content. We can all choose to not view or not mirror content we don’t agree with, but nobody can single-handedly own or modify the data

          • cryball@sopuli.xyz
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            1 year ago

            Unless each node holds all the data, it is not guaranteed to stay available. Mirroring content across 2, 3, or even 10 servers wouldn’t guarantee that it will remain eg. after 10 years. Even torrents die after they are no longer popular and people stop seeding them.

            I still hold my opinion that using an actual blockchain to hold the conversations is not scalable solution at all. Only unique thing it would enable is for unwanted content to remain permanently in the system.

        • a1studmuffin@aussie.zone
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          1 year ago

          Yeah that’s a good point. But this way we can’t mine LemmyCoin. Won’t someone think of the shitcoins!?

          • cryball@sopuli.xyz
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            1 year ago

            For sure if reddit can have moons, then a blockchain forum should have their own shitcoin. How else would the founder of the decentralized platform make some bank? Get donations from from the general public for the volunteer work they do on the project? No way :)